Men, Accountability, and the Myth That Women Are the Problem with Lex | S3E4

You’re not “too sensitive.” You’re reacting to a system that teaches men entitlement and then calls women dramatic for pushing back. If accountability feels like a constant uphill battle in your relationships, there’s a reason.
In this conversation, Lisa sits down with Lex, a psychotherapist and male creator who’s willing to say the quiet part out loud. Together, they dismantle the myth that women “don’t take accountability” and name what’s actually happening underneath the defensiveness, blame-shifting, and emotional shutdown so many women are navigating. 

Lex shares how unpacking his own internalized misogyny changed the way he understands relationships, power, and responsibility,  and why men centering themselves in conversations about harm is part of the problem, not the solution. This conversation weaves together patriarchy, emotional suppression, entitlement, and why abuse thrives where accountability is avoided.
If you’ve ever been told you “provoked” mistreatment, carried the emotional labor for two people, or felt like your pain was dismissed as an attack, this conversation will help you see the truth clearly. 
Accountability isn’t cruelty. It’s the bare minimum.

Transcript

00:00:00:00 - 00:00:08:17
Music


00:00:08:19 - 00:00:15:08
Lisa Sonni
This is Real Talk With Lisa Sonni: Relationships Uncensored. The podcast they don't want you listening to.

00:00:15:10 - 00:00:17:13
Lex_Therapy
And.

00:00:17:15 - 00:00:39:06
Lisa Sonni
Today I want to talk about one of my most favorite topics, the most annoying topics in the world to me, but it's such a good one that really needs more conversation around this. And this is the concept of accountability, particularly when it comes to men. But I really mean toxic men, abusive men, you know, and I hate to say it, I almost want to choke on my words, but not all men.

00:00:39:10 - 00:01:13:18
Lisa Sonni
I think that sometimes needs to be said, although sparingly and in certain circumstances. But there is a problem that I see particularly online. But it's showing up in relationships, in dating and marriages where accountability is this big debate. And I think there's a massive misunderstanding in how toxic or abusive men see accountability versus how women see accountability, what the actual definition is, and it creates a whole world of problems, is really fits within, to me, how the patriarchy harms relationships for both men and women.

00:01:13:19 - 00:01:29:09
Lisa Sonni
And I follow a lot of people online who talk about this. So I want to introduce my guest. He's known online as Lex Therapy. But Lex, can you just introduce yourself, maybe tell us a little bit about who you are and maybe what led you to make content in this arena?

00:01:29:13 - 00:01:54:19
Lex_Therapy
Yeah, absolutely. Thanks for having me on. So when I came onto TikTok, for me, I actually wanted to do relationship content, believe it or not. And I started to have my For You page and the feed giving me, I suppose, what people describe as red pill type of rhetoric. And I had some friends that I was always sharing these videos with, sort of saying, I kind of agree with some of the things that being said, but then I don't understand these parts that then led me down a journey of realizing that I had some misogynistic views.

00:01:54:22 - 00:02:16:12
Lex_Therapy
And once I started unpacking them and learning more about them, I actually realized that this is a journey myself, that I could go on, that I want to use TikTok to be able to do that with. I also am a psychotherapist, so I do mental health lives as well as BI. So I did. I'm coming to that bit later, but that's how it kind of started with doing lives, which was supporting people for their mental health in ways online when possible.

00:02:16:12 - 00:02:37:16
Lex_Therapy
And then it came to an awareness of mine that men tend to listen to men more than they do women. And I started to see that in spaces a lot as well, respecting men in different ways to women, let's say. And I kind of got guided that if I actually use this platform to raise an awareness, it's more likely that men might listen to me as a man than women, even if you're saying the same thing.

00:02:37:19 - 00:02:47:09
Lex_Therapy
So that's how I then got into understanding more about unpacking misogyny, seeing in what ways it affects men, how that also then affects relationship dynamics, and then kind of brought me to where I am at the moment.

00:02:47:09 - 00:03:08:06
Lisa Sonni
Now I love it, and actually I hate what you said in the sense that men listen to men before they'll listen to women. But let's just acknowledge that right here as an actual truth, and that I appreciate men in this space. The good men, in the sense that you're here for the right reasons, because I know there's a whole a whole topic of performative kind of feminism from some men.

00:03:08:06 - 00:03:31:09
Lisa Sonni
But when I watch your content and the way that you break down scenarios that you see, I'm like, he gets it, you you seem to really understand the harm that can be done in these relationships. So your your content is appreciated and very educational. And I obviously recommend that people watch it. I want to ask you about accountability in what you see, I guess particularly online.

00:03:31:09 - 00:03:43:14
Lisa Sonni
But this translates to real life. What do you see when you hear men leave comments that are like 100 women versus accountability, implying that we don't have it and that men do. What do you.

00:03:43:14 - 00:04:05:16
Lex_Therapy
See? Yeah, it's a bit of a subtle oh dear, for thing, because I look at it and think to myself, it's very much perceived as an attack. And I think what a lot of men don't realize is the calling out a behavior is not necessarily reflection on you as a person, but more so that particular behavior demonstrated. And I think men use it as a way to say that has summarized me as who I am versus there is an opportunity that to learn.

00:04:05:16 - 00:04:24:06
Lex_Therapy
So men at times don't distance themselves in the right way, and they think that they are being bombarded with, you know, these kind of accusations and horrific comments about, you know, set who they are as a person. And I think unfortunately, that's where the accountability becomes more of a deflection. I think ego is driven more than recognizing, actually, there's an opportunity here to learn.

00:04:24:07 - 00:04:41:18
Lex_Therapy
And I get that in the lives that I do as well. It's like when I talk about certain things and I highlight misogynistic things, they say what's difficult for me as I sit and think to myself, I was you maybe two years ago, as like, I would have said similar things to what you've said. I get it, I get where you are right now on that journey if you want to go on that journey.

00:04:41:18 - 00:05:03:18
Lex_Therapy
But it's an opportunity to learn. It's an opportunity to be better now understands me. There's different responses that these men might get from other people, so I get a lot of comments about how potentially, I'm quite patient with these men. And I sit and think, well, I've never experienced misogyny. I'm not going to experience misogyny. So when women hear the things that these men say is going to trigger different things, it could come from a trauma response.

00:05:03:18 - 00:05:21:04
Lex_Therapy
It could come from an experience. It could come from just, again, the upholding of that patriarchy and the same rhetoric that continues to oppress women and girls in different ways. I'm not going to feel that emotional connection to what's being said. For me, it's it's just a comment so I can sit there and listen to it and address it.

00:05:21:04 - 00:05:39:20
Lex_Therapy
But because there are so many messages that I would say said from a place of passion, a place of, you know, recognizing how harmful it is, you can't control how people are going to react to the misogyny that's been put that way. And so then the accountability for them almost becomes like my guards up by walls are up, people are attacking me, I'm out.

00:05:39:23 - 00:05:53:17
Lex_Therapy
And then that's how easy is to avoid the accountability. And that unfortunately, I think is where a lot of men disconnect, but also because they feel like they can. It's almost like a male privilege thing where it's like, I don't need to have this, I don't need to hear all this. I can just leave this life and continue my thoughts.

00:05:53:17 - 00:05:55:20
Lex_Therapy
But then unfortunately, nothing then gets done about it.

00:05:55:22 - 00:06:14:13
Lisa Sonni
I think that the want to change, the want to see this part, there's there's something broken in that there's a comfort, I think and you know, you talk about male privilege. I always find that whenever I've said men have privilege, you immediately get men that are like, what privilege? Name one right. That women don't have that men do.

00:06:14:13 - 00:06:33:16
Lisa Sonni
And I think if you look at privilege as a law or you look privilege because they sort of frame it immediately as what rights, meaning what laws don't apply to both genders, but it's not just that. If you don't see the ability to walk to your car without your car keys in your hand, you are not seeing the privilege.

00:06:33:18 - 00:06:56:12
Lisa Sonni
They see privileges, more money or more or whatever, but they're not seeing just like the day to day things or, you know, like, well, men get worried about being attacked too, by other men. And I would argue it's not the same anyway, because men maybe feel a little. Most men, not all, not all men feel that they can defend themselves a little bit better, but they don't see even the privilege of I don't have to look at this.

00:06:56:12 - 00:07:21:10
Lisa Sonni
I don't have to take accountability. It baffles me when I see this concept that women are not taking accountability, because I'll tell you what I see is men are outright saying that we are not taking accountability for our behavior that provokes them to assault women, harm women, be extremely misogynistic towards women or whatever, but women have to take accountability for provocation.

00:07:21:15 - 00:07:25:22
Lisa Sonni
Do you see that? I've seen that in some of your videos before, where you're commenting on that in some stitches?

00:07:26:03 - 00:07:44:21
Lex_Therapy
Yeah, absolutely. And I think that I pose so many hypotheticals to men to try and get them to understand it. And what's really unfortunate is once you put a hypothetical in front of them that involves maybe a close family member of them, like a younger sister or older of a younger sister or a daughter. Suddenly then they get it.

00:07:45:01 - 00:08:07:01
Lex_Therapy
And a couple of examples of this is even just saying, would you be comfortable with a man babysitting your three year old daughter? And they sort of like, pause for a minute and you sort of go, that gut feeling that you got right there, that's the empathy, that moment right there where you don't want to say it out loud, but you know, the real answer is that you would probably feel uncomfortable with it is getting you to recognize that that's how women feel around men they don't know, even sometimes they do know.

00:08:07:01 - 00:08:25:07
Lex_Therapy
But the point is, you know, the fear of men is increasing based on their behavior. And if you're taking it personally, when you know yourself, maybe whether you do or don't engage in those behaviors, do you even know it's about you or it's not? So my premise of the All Men is it includes you in the conversation, but doesn't necessarily accuse you of the violation.

00:08:25:07 - 00:08:30:00
Lex_Therapy
That's how I look at it. I want to have that conversation with these men. Okay. So your reaction when.

00:08:30:00 - 00:08:40:18
Lisa Sonni
You worded that, that's actually phenomenal. You're in being invited into the conversation. Yeah. Some of them don't want to be that. They don't want to be part of conversation. I feel that for sure.

00:08:40:20 - 00:09:01:20
Lex_Therapy
And when you when you then invite them into it and you have the conversation about some topics that I talk about, the answers and responses they give will leave a reveal the misogyny or not. And so when you then start saying things that is from a place of misogyny, you can go, okay, so this is recognizing that actually this is for you, this content, these conversations, these topics is literally education for you.

00:09:01:22 - 00:09:19:04
Lex_Therapy
Because we can now look at the reasons why you have thoughts a certain way or view women in a certain way because of where it comes from. So I try to use that premise because then it's almost like saying all men are included in the conversation, but there's no way that you can avoid that. But if you know in your heart of hearts that you're not someone that upholds these behaviors, then why are you feeling attacked?

00:09:19:04 - 00:09:32:22
Lex_Therapy
Because the prompt doesn't say your name. It says men. So if you're a man, you are part of men. Are you part of the problem, the solution? Well, that's where the conversation comes in. We'll find out. So until then, if you've got nothing to hide, you should feel absolutely fine talking about it.

00:09:33:00 - 00:09:59:08
Lisa Sonni
Yeah. And they don't. And I guess you're right. I mean, like, there's your answer that makes it really, really quite clear. What I see is the expectation that women behave differently so that men won't react. That's a worldview, a belief system that really exists in abusive relationships. My content is really geared towards people who are women, who have been abused by men or in toxic relationships with men.

00:09:59:08 - 00:10:24:10
Lisa Sonni
And this thread of like, I don't want to have the conversation in the relationship, shutting down conversations about patriarchy or questioning if the patriarchy exists, you know, really questioning accountability, the blame shifting that you see in these abusive dynamics. But I see it all is so connected to the lack of accountability in men. And then I sit here online and I watch it constantly being flipped, saying, women aren't taking accountability.

00:10:24:12 - 00:10:34:23
Lisa Sonni
What do you think? I mean, what do you think is really driving that underneath this ability of, you know, I feel attacked and I don't want to what are they trying to avoid? Accountability I mean, ability yeah.

00:10:35:00 - 00:10:49:17
Lex_Therapy
I think it's I think it's yeah. Yeah, I think it's recognizing that a change might need to be made. So what I always try to do is I try to view it as a domino effect. Right. If you got rid of and I'm going to use the word misandry with quotations. Right. Because men throw it around all the time.

00:10:49:17 - 00:11:09:18
Lex_Therapy
Right. And I think there's something to be said for mistaken misandry as opposed to misandry. But if misandry stops tomorrow, misogyny wouldn't be as if misogyny stopped tomorrow. That so-called misandry would disappear. Why? Because it's a reaction. The reaction is, I'm experiencing your misogyny. I don't have to now respond to you kindly about you treating me a certain way.

00:11:09:20 - 00:11:26:22
Lex_Therapy
So the issue I have is I've actually done prompts before where I say men can't hold women accountable. That's a prompt that I've had in the prompt I believe in because I don't see how the oppressor can expect the oppressed to be accountable for things that the oppressor has put in place. And when I say put in place, I know that goes back time and time.

00:11:27:03 - 00:11:42:01
Lex_Therapy
But the point is, it's still upheld today. So for me, anything that you really do think, in my opinion, you think women collectively are accountable for is nothing that I would say they are accountable for, that men also aren't doing. So. That's not being unique to women, right? Because some people have been like, what about women when they cheat?

00:11:42:01 - 00:12:04:15
Lex_Therapy
And it's like, what you think men don't cheat. That's not a woman's thing, right? Whereas disproportionate violence towards women and girls being misogynistic is literally men, right? That is something men do. That is something men uphold. And it's disproportionate. You can't find anything that's the opposite. And the closest that men have ever come to with any kind of example is the aspect of, you know, the justice system with children, right?

00:12:04:15 - 00:12:24:04
Lex_Therapy
But again, when you come back to that, it's not women that put those laws in place. It's not women that put those gender stereotypical roles in place. So the things you're complaining about, believe it or not, is the exact same system feminism is advocating to get rid of. So it doesn't make sense how you can always say the women are responsible for something that they also technically would want to see changed, to be more equal.

00:12:24:09 - 00:12:41:13
Lex_Therapy
So yeah, I don't see how you can hold women accountable for things, but there's a desperation for men to do that because right now the focus is on things. Men need to be held accountable. So I've got 3 or 4 examples of things the men have deflected with whenever they've kind of been the center of attention for needing counsel, but needs to be had.

00:12:41:18 - 00:12:44:05
Lex_Therapy
So one is, if you remember the man, they're hypothetical.

00:12:44:06 - 00:12:51:05
Lisa Sonni
Oh, the oh, man, I should have got in on that conversation. I barely did, but I had an opinion. But I want to hear yours.

00:12:51:10 - 00:13:11:02
Lex_Therapy
All right. So the man, they're hypothetical. As soon as that was discussed heavily, men responded with, well, would you rather express your emotions to a woman or treat so immediately, let's retaliate rather than acknowledge what's going on. Now, for me, that was contradicting on so many levels, because I don't believe men actually open up to men. So to try and make out the opening up to women is a bad idea.

00:13:11:02 - 00:13:24:18
Lex_Therapy
If you are. If you're opening up to your male friends, then at least fair enough. But men don't do that. They're still fearful of the judgment. They're still fearful of being called less masculine, is still fearful of being, you know, ostracized from a group of friends and being perceived as weak. So men also don't look up to men.

00:13:24:20 - 00:13:41:22
Lex_Therapy
The other example is International Women's Day. The most one of those Google searches on that day is when is International Men's Day? Whereas when it's International Men's Day, the most Google searches. What is it about? So it's it's like when women have their day for that men are interested in when's it about us trying to sense themselves again.

00:13:42:00 - 00:14:00:01
Lex_Therapy
So every time something comes up, men are not actually like listening. They're just trying to, you know, retaliate or do their own movement as a spin off of it. I think similar to what's going on in South Africa at the moment, a lot of people are turning their profile pictures purple in, in support, and men decided to change their screen and do their own thing.

00:14:00:06 - 00:14:20:00
Lex_Therapy
And it's like, have you not noticed how women are driving for this kind of awareness conversation change and men are just copying rather than actually doing things themselves, when if we really think about it, they probably have more of the resources and power to do it themselves, but they just know. So it's more of an accountability. It's at times kind of kind of laziness at times as well.

00:14:20:01 - 00:14:29:14
Lex_Therapy
Like they genuinely could put things in place for men that are struggling with things. But when women talk about it, it's not okay. And when men talk about it is there's double standards as well.

00:14:29:14 - 00:14:51:00
Lisa Sonni
Gotta love it, which is very narcissistic. I'm just saying when you sort of you see the superiority behind, I can talk about this and you're not allowed to talk about this, especially as it relates to gender. I do find that men give themselves that freedom like I'm really reminded of something you said. Just sort of made me think of this feeling of, you know, men are not allowed to share their feelings.

00:14:51:00 - 00:15:12:05
Lisa Sonni
You know, you're talking about the man talking to a tree. Would you rather share your feelings with a tree or a woman? I don't know, I would ask men to share it with the tree before me, and I know that might sound callous. However, men are sharing their feelings and I'm quoting that too. Typically is yelling or, you know, being being very rude devaluation criticism.

00:15:12:08 - 00:15:34:16
Lisa Sonni
And it's loud and it's angry. That's the feeling that they want to express. And I feel like I've got children. I'd say, I said to both of my children, you're allowed to be angry and you're not allowed to yell. And I don't understand why a lot of men feel that especially toxic, abusive men have this need to yell at you because they feel that they can and they feel justified because you did.

00:15:34:16 - 00:15:51:11
Lisa Sonni
Something kind of comes back to the provocation. But they then say, you don't let me have feelings, and it's like you have to take a step back and go, that's not that's not what we're talking about here. You can have feelings and you can't punch holes in the wall. You need to take accountability for punching a hole in the wall.

00:15:51:11 - 00:16:08:07
Lisa Sonni
I don't need to take accountability for making you because I think, let me ask this as a question. What do you think that actually says about men? The way that men talk about themselves? Like, well, what was I supposed to do? She cheated. I had to beat her up. She, you know, provoked me. I had to punch a hole in the wall.

00:16:08:09 - 00:16:09:08
Lisa Sonni
What's your take on that?

00:16:09:13 - 00:16:29:16
Lex_Therapy
My take on it is that I generally don't think that men have the tools to manage their emotions as well as, you know, they could. I think from a young age, if we were to go back from fathers to fathers, fathers and grandfathers, etc., I think the stereotypical role of a man has always been to, you know, it's always been encouraged to suppress rather than express, you know, phrases like boys don't cry.

00:16:29:17 - 00:16:52:00
Lex_Therapy
Phrases like man up crying makes you weak. These are all common phrases that we know of and it's come from somewhere. These are also phrases that fathers would pass down to their sons. I don't think that we. I'm not saying that women have never done that. Again, I'm talking about the disproportionate and this idea of like, if I'm raising my son and I want him to be like me, then I'm going to, you know, give him different kind of advice from my partner and it's on that.

00:16:52:00 - 00:17:13:17
Lex_Therapy
So what ends up happening, in my opinion, is you have boys being encouraged that when they're feeling this kind of, let's say, sadness, not even anger, and it's on the level of not uncontrollable, but you could say, oh, it's quite strong. There's an encouragement, I think, from fathers, to stop it because they feel uncomfortable seeing this son like that rather than sitting with it and saying, hey, this, this seems like it's really difficult for you.

00:17:13:17 - 00:17:28:09
Lex_Therapy
I'm going to sit here with you. We're going to process this together. But this encouragement of it's allowed in this room. Express it. I'm here with you and we can get through this together. If you have the opposite, which is more, stop crying. But you've been doing this for a long time now. It's getting too much. You need to stop then.

00:17:28:09 - 00:17:46:00
Lex_Therapy
I think it encourages boys to start realizing that actually, these emotions aren't welcome in front of my dad. Unwelcome in this house. And so if they went off to school one day and they came home feeling, you know, really overwhelmed from anything that's happened, what's going on? Their mind is I can't be sad in front of dad. I can't quite in front of dad because he doesn't like it, because he will say stop.

00:17:46:03 - 00:18:14:08
Lex_Therapy
So now I'm training myself to hold it together, and therefore I'm not allowing my body to naturally respond to these emotions. And that build up gets to the point where it can turn into anger. When there's too much being held together, it doesn't get released safely. Right. And so for me, I think back kind of in place of, of if you've got now a collection of boys at school who hang out with each other and they've all been similarly raised, where is the emotional expression amongst each other when they recognize when their friends is going through a tough time?

00:18:14:10 - 00:18:31:08
Lex_Therapy
But like, where's the sense of it? Like, I can sense that you're really, like, struggling at the moment. Is everything okay? Yeah. Come and talk to me about it. I've got five, ten minutes. No, instead it's stop. Like, okay, we don't do that in our friendship. And so again, do I say at one of my prompts at times has been that I think men's friendships are surface level.

00:18:31:09 - 00:18:48:15
Lex_Therapy
I don't think there's much depth to them because they bond over things like gaming, maybe going to the pub sports, right. Talking about girls. And it's like that is also a great tool for deflection and avoidance. Oh, you're feeling down. Come on, let's go play football. You feel better. Oh like come on let's go play some games. And that will help.

00:18:48:15 - 00:18:56:00
Lex_Therapy
And you know we'll have a laugh. And then for a minute yeah your brain switches off a bit. But then does the issue go away. No, it remains right.

00:18:56:00 - 00:19:14:00
Lisa Sonni
And it's it's infuriating. Now to your point, I believe that it's the patriarchy that sets this up and that men have a love hate relationship with the patriarchy. Right? Because it gives you guys a lot of benefits, I realize. But it also harms you. And I feel I feel like when we talk about women's issues, men will always be like, well, what about men?

00:19:14:00 - 00:19:35:23
Lisa Sonni
We have higher rates of suicide and higher rates of homelessness and incarceration. And I'm like, yes, I agree. We all agree that the patriarchy is bad. And then they deny that the patriarchy exists. And I'm like, because in relationships, men will say, we can't share our feelings with women, right? They're not talking about male friendships. They're talking about their relationship with women.

00:19:36:02 - 00:19:59:08
Lisa Sonni
But I think what's interesting is you're right and I'm right. Men can't share their feelings at all. But it's it's themselves I think, that have kind of set that up, obviously. But they don't blame their male friends for not being able to open up. They focus that on women because, well, because of misogyny, I'm sure, but they see women as the people that they're allowed to sort of put this on.

00:19:59:08 - 00:20:22:06
Lisa Sonni
And when women shut their feelings down and I see plenty of women say, women don't do that, it's men. And I'm like, actually be rare to catch me defending men. But in their defense, it's both men and women that shut them down. But all they're pointing out is that women uphold the patriarchy, too. And it's less women than men, in my opinion, that are actually pushing back and won't let men share their feelings.

00:20:22:09 - 00:20:42:05
Lisa Sonni
I do think sometimes women kind of like maybe they don't use the phrase man up, but something that feels like that, like, don't share your feelings. But I also question the way men communicate their feelings. Like I said, sometimes they're yelling or angry and it sort of they all need to read the book Nonviolent Communication in my in my view, I don't know if you've ever read and it's a good book.

00:20:42:05 - 00:21:05:13
Lex_Therapy
Haven't, hasn't. But I think this comes on to my second point of that story, let's say, or that kind of description, which is that when I was talking about how these skills are, therefore they're not transferable into relationships. So I actually think sounds really bad to say as well. But I think nowadays men are terrible at dating. And the reason why is because I still think that what men will do is they'll look for the surface level and think that's what is meaningful in this moment in terms of success.

00:21:05:15 - 00:21:32:03
Lex_Therapy
So they'll go on a date. And if she laughs, if there's a bit of flirting, a bit of charm, maybe a bit of intimacy and I've come off looking all right. Tick. Successful day. And so what do men do similar to what their dads encourage them to do with, with patterns of how you manage emotions. They repeat. So it's like, right, if I keep being funny, if I keep on, you know, like seeing that she's having a good time and we keep going and finding out little bits of information more with each other, then this will keep going down that route.

00:21:32:05 - 00:21:47:06
Lex_Therapy
But at what point are you having a conversation with her on an emotionally intelligent level? At what point are you asking questions? Something along the lines of what's the biggest challenge you've overcome this year? Something that just allows you to connect a bit deeper than just like, oh, what job do you do? Oh, what's your favorite color? Like?

00:21:47:06 - 00:22:08:11
Lex_Therapy
Those kind of things, right? That's something men don't do. So then what happens? They have a year or two of getting together and, you know, continuing the same thing. Then they get hit with a lump of anxiety and they don't want to go to their partner about it because red pill heavily convinces you not to share your emotions with your partner, tells you that they'll use it against you, but then when they do, that partner is a bit like, whoa, never seen this side of you before.

00:22:08:12 - 00:22:25:14
Lex_Therapy
Like, you know, it's a surprise to them. It's a shock. And I agree with you. Like, you know, again, this aspect of, you know, all men. Yes, there are women who behave inappropriately. There are women who respond in ways that aren't respectful. But you can kind of see at times why, if they've got to know a version of you that isn't you being your authentic self.

00:22:25:14 - 00:22:41:14
Lex_Therapy
And so at what point in relationships do you say to yourself, I want to be with someone where if I'm going through it, I'm not going to get judged by them. I've tested that out because I know how they respond in these situations. If they haven't done that, and what are you setting yourself up for? Is setting yourself up for a relationship where you're hiding a part of yourself.

00:22:41:18 - 00:22:55:16
Lex_Therapy
And I don't think people should be in relationships where they feel the need to because they'll use descriptions like, oh, I need to protect her from me, or I need to protect myself from her. And it's like, why? What's going on there that you feel you need to do that? I do apologize to cut those. Let's get involved.

00:22:55:19 - 00:23:01:04
Lex_Therapy
But yes, but that that's that's where it is for me. On the relationship aspect. That's the bit that I find quite difficult.

00:23:01:07 - 00:23:31:00
Lisa Sonni
Yeah, it feels maddening when you're in a relationship with someone like this. And the women that I work with, the women that I coach to talk about these abusive men who are in my view, choosing to not take accountability in relationships and to just put it on their partner. There's this real interesting kind of externalization of responsibility that studies have shown that men are way more likely to externalize and figure out, like, who provoked me?

00:23:31:01 - 00:23:59:19
Lisa Sonni
Why did this happen? It's not me. It's something external. And women are far more likely to actually internalize the blame and ask themselves, what have I done to deserve this? And I feel like it's kind of almost like when I say perfect, I actually mean awful. But it's a perfect match because a woman who's more likely to say, what did I do to deserve this is going to be great for a man who's like, yeah, you did something to deserve cheating, abuse, toxicity, lies, betrayal, yelling, whatever.

00:24:00:00 - 00:24:22:06
Lisa Sonni
But where's the solution in this? You know, I find I have a pretty strong opinion on un certain men's ability to change, and in that it's been studied and abusive men like I don't mean men who lack some skills or even really toxic because I have a belief that toxic people can change and abusive people just. And I'm not even going to say can't, but don't.

00:24:22:09 - 00:24:47:10
Lisa Sonni
Studies show that there is a massive lack of growth and change, particularly in abusive men, because it all roots back to this belief system, which is misogyny, entitlement, lack of accountability. Like, how do you get away from that? But I think content like yours is certainly helping. But I also think that this lack of accountability, that's blaming women, blaming your partner, it lowers the bar for men.

00:24:47:10 - 00:24:50:20
Lisa Sonni
And you hear women say all the time, the bars already in hell, yeah.

00:24:51:00 - 00:25:10:20
Lex_Therapy
Yeah, I get that. As well. And I think that when men get invited into this conversation, you can always tell from the first couple of sentences whether they hate to debate or learn. And that also sets of kind of premise as well. Right? It is this idea of I'm here to debate you and I say I to myself, I understand how other people I'm posing this ideology, though everything I say is right.

00:25:10:22 - 00:25:25:09
Lex_Therapy
I get that what I'm doing is countering statements that have already been put out there that are misogynistic. So I'm saying like, if we can acknowledge the misogyny behind them and I can explain that, I'm not saying it ultimately makes me right, but I'm saying not many men have been able to really explain how it's from something different.

00:25:25:11 - 00:25:40:09
Lex_Therapy
Now, one of the biggest things that does come into the conversation is this aspect of body count and how that's like, you know, yes, I know, yeah. And insecurities. And I think that is also another emotion that I think men struggle with is the insecurity of things. And the way that that in comes out as a behavior.

00:25:40:12 - 00:26:07:01
Lisa Sonni
I agree, and actually, on the topic of insecurity, I find this really interesting because I've looked into this, you know, I'll say for personal reasons, but I found it fascinating that insecurity is often an excuse. And I'm not taking away from the fact that insecurity is a very real thing. And men and women both experience that. But a lot of abusive men use the concept of or the word insecurity, and they're actually just trying to control you.

00:26:07:01 - 00:26:25:22
Lisa Sonni
They're not insecure. They'll tell you, like, my ex cheated on me. So you can't go to the, the the pub with your friends or you can't go out. You can't, you know, have freedom. You can't have privacy because I was cheated on in the past. Or you know how women are, right? Women are. So they're they're liars and they cheat and they do all these horrible things to men.

00:26:26:01 - 00:26:46:02
Lisa Sonni
So you don't get freedom, but it's hiding behind insecurity. I think a truly insecure man would say, I feel nervous, I feel insecure, you know, whatever language, because I don't expect everybody to have all the therapy talk. But I feel nervous when you go out. I feel anxious when you're out. I worry that other men are looking at you, and I know that's my problem.

00:26:46:02 - 00:27:01:01
Lisa Sonni
I don't want you to change anything but something that I'm working through. And I wonder if we could stay more connected when you're out. But an abusive man is like, you can't go out. I don't know if you saw that sort of viral video of a man being like, when my girl wants to go out with her girlfriends, she can have a girls night.

00:27:01:01 - 00:27:08:21
Lisa Sonni
I'll pay for it. Take my card. But if you're not home by 11 p.m., then you're not allowed to go out anymore. Because you broke my trust.

00:27:09:00 - 00:27:25:10
Lex_Therapy
Yeah, I think the what's interesting, what's interesting with this is the projection. Because when. So I do this again with men as well the all men and no man. My secondary part of that is the men appointed themselves in different ways. So as in men, no, it's all men and women. And I'll give examples. And one of them is the popping out of sphere.

00:27:25:13 - 00:27:38:21
Lex_Therapy
So I say to men, when they come up, I say, would you feel comfortable with your partner going clubbing without you? And they say, not really. And I say, why? And I'll say, well, because she could get her. Men could start approaching her. Someone could maybe spike her drink. And I'm like, okay, I hear all that first off.

00:27:39:03 - 00:27:57:02
Lex_Therapy
So would you feel more comfortable if she said she's going to an all woman's club? I'm like, yeah, probably. And I'm like, okay. So the key thing we can acknowledge here is when men are around, your anxiety levels go up. Right? And so what you're essentially saying is that if men are around, you feel more uncomfortable with your partner going clubbing.

00:27:57:03 - 00:28:18:15
Lex_Therapy
And you know yourself, you know, every man at that club is going to harm your partner, but you know, there's enough of them that it could happen. And so I say, when it benefits men or women and solo men is okay to uphold. But when women say it's a generalization and I'm saying it again, like when you came back to the accountability is literally avoiding accountability because men will say this in different ways.

00:28:18:20 - 00:28:20:08
Lex_Therapy
They just don't like it when women say.

00:28:20:13 - 00:28:45:07
Lisa Sonni
Well, I mean, I'm happy to let you say it more often than any of the other male creators and and men in the world. I mean, it's not all about social media who can help people see this. I think asking questions and just letting it sit. I recall of watching a podcast, actually, and I don't remember the name of the podcast, but it was a bunch of guys sitting around and one guy was saying, I don't understand why she's always like on me about putting in effort.

00:28:45:07 - 00:28:59:13
Lisa Sonni
She's always effort. You don't put in an effort. And he got really upset. And one of the the other hosts kind of went with them on it and then flipped it with the guy. Didn't even realize that he was flipping it, but he was like, tell me, you know, do you want your girlfriend to cook for you or order takeout?

00:28:59:17 - 00:29:13:09
Lisa Sonni
And then he was like, oh, I mean, I feel way more appreciated when she cooks for me. And the guy was like, why? And he's like, you know, because she just put in more. And he started bubbling and they were like, ever. You were going to say effort. I know it, and I love that that happened because I'm like, that is how we bridge things here.

00:29:13:09 - 00:29:37:08
Lisa Sonni
That's how we get things better. It's men handling this problem, taking accountability and helping themselves. Because I could say that. I could say it's effort. You like effort. But what I saw in that clip was a lack of awareness that we both deserve effort in a relationship. He saw it as he deserves effort, so she should cook, not order takeout.

00:29:37:10 - 00:29:53:00
Lisa Sonni
But yet he didn't want to reciprocate that. And I'm like, where's the accountability of like, you know, actually you have a good point. He actually just kind of shut the conversation down. Even in the episode. I didn't see him go, oh, you're right. He just kind of laughed it at himself and made it seem like people misunderstood.

00:29:53:04 - 00:30:08:18
Lex_Therapy
If you got a big platform, you can't be seen to having to backtracking on your main points that you've always lived off of because otherwise your whole audience something then loses respect for you, right? So so again, it's this idea of how men view men which is more important than men. Again, holding themselves accountable, that that's more important to them.

00:30:08:18 - 00:30:26:13
Lex_Therapy
The like, the image of how they all portrayed and perceived. And so what I think with that, the issue that I also find is in this space, there's always this kind of I'll take accountability as long as if women do for something. Oh yeah. You know, there always has to be this kind of if I see that happening, then maybe I'll be inclined to.

00:30:26:13 - 00:30:45:22
Lex_Therapy
And it's like that. Even if you did, that's still not you taking accountability. Then that's you just almost saying I'll own up to something because someone else has, you know? So for me, unfortunately, there's there's too many contradictions in the points that men make. And that's what bugs me the most about the space, right, is that they'll say one thing and I'll go, yeah, but you also say that here in a different way.

00:30:45:22 - 00:31:01:05
Lex_Therapy
So how does that work? And then they get stuck a lot of the time because a lot of it is so conditioned. A lot of it is learned from whether it's red pill or other kind of, you know, things that are out there that I'm not going to name just in case. But, you know, when you get meds, kind of challenge it on a deeper level.

00:31:01:05 - 00:31:20:10
Lex_Therapy
They'll use words like preferences, standards and values all the time. And I'm like, how did you come to the conclusion that this is a preference? And they can't, you know, but what they will do sometimes is they'll come to say, oh, here's a study on it. And they haven't read the study, because sometimes the study and sometimes the studies been done on birds, sometimes a study has been done on 200 people.

00:31:20:13 - 00:31:41:13
Lex_Therapy
And you think to yourself, you've just kind of almost done a ChatGPT kind of like, oh, let me find something. And then I say to them, do you study everything else in your life? And I've noticed that a lot of the time, whenever it's to maybe uphold something misogynistic, they'll go and find a study for it. I'm thinking, do you use studies to go and find out what friends are going to be like with you based on their behaviors, or do you just make friends and you accept them for who they are?

00:31:41:15 - 00:31:59:16
Lex_Therapy
The other aspect of accountability for me as well is enabling other men. So when they talk about misogyny in their behaviors, enabling your friend when they say something or do something derogatory towards women. If you are someone who just kind of ignores it and you sort of have this concept of, well, I didn't say it, I didn't do it, so I'm not a problem.

00:31:59:18 - 00:32:16:13
Lex_Therapy
That's another issue. And that comes back to, again, how, you know, strong men's friendships are had someone come up on the panel not too long ago and I said, if your friend catcalled a woman, would you still be his friend? And he said, well, I tell him what he did was wrong and hope that he would change. And I said, okay, but let's say that he decided to ignore you.

00:32:16:13 - 00:32:31:14
Lex_Therapy
Let's say he wasn't going to change. Would you still be his friend? And he said, yeah. And I'm like, you're part of the problem then because you're basically saying him not listening to me is okay in our friendship because he doesn't think I've got anything valuable to add. And you're also happy to be associating with someone who continues to behave that way.

00:32:31:16 - 00:32:43:05
Lex_Therapy
That's an area for you to be accountable. And I think unfortunately, when they hear the word accountable, they think that it's like, oh, we have to be accountable for everything. And it's like, well, unfortunately there is a lot that you haven't been accountable for. And this is where we're at the moment.

00:32:43:06 - 00:33:02:18
Lisa Sonni
Catching up is hard. You know, I do I appreciate it feels like a lot. And even, you know, in the context of inviting men into this conversation, as a woman who has been harmed by men, and I know a lot of men are like, you know, the who hurt you, dude? More men than I could ever possibly list off for you.

00:33:02:18 - 00:33:40:12
Lisa Sonni
So hundreds of men. And that's not uncommon. I'm not special. That's very common. But men, the answer is men. Many, many men. And I don't know if I understand why men feel so desperate to, like, separate themselves from that group of people. Women have been harmed. And when I am inviting men into a conversation and I have to push back and deal with defensiveness and a lack of accountability and just anger coming at me, I get told so often that I need to invite them into the conversation differently or better, or that I'm a little too aggressive, or I sound angry and that that's not going to help men.

00:33:40:14 - 00:34:00:20
Lisa Sonni
I cannot tell you the expletives that want to fly out of my mouth, because I don't need to be softer for men to treat me better. That's again putting it on me. It's just a perfect demonstration of a lack of accountability and saying women aren't asking me nicely enough to stop being abusive or misogynistic. Go away.

00:34:00:23 - 00:34:31:04
Lex_Therapy
There's actually lots of layers to this because this also taps into misogyny. Well, if we look at the way that black and brown women hold the exact same conversations, they will get told they're aggressive. They'll get told that they're, you know, being overemotional or responding in a very different way to other people. And those microaggressions and, you know, racism, misogyny like that is exactly how, you know, if we if we go into the intersections of it, it's worse for other women, you know, because men use certain ways of talking, this aspect of tone policing very differently as well.

00:34:31:04 - 00:34:46:18
Lex_Therapy
And that like, there's so many layers to it, the even trying to scratch the surface with men at times is so difficult for them to kind of see what's happening because they're so wrapped up on all your attacking me. All this is about me again, centering yourself, me, me, me. And it's a broad topic of conversation.

00:34:46:22 - 00:35:09:18
Lisa Sonni
I can talk endlessly about it. Tell me, in your experience, what do you see as the biggest problem when you're looking at accountability in a relationship? A man's not taking accountability. He's blaming her. He's he's not providing an emotionally safe space and then blames all the problems for the relationship on her. She's provoked him. She is the cause of I was even within cheating.

00:35:09:18 - 00:35:31:01
Lisa Sonni
You know, I find that if a woman cheats on a man, then it makes sense that he abuses her, harms her, cheats back, kills her all the things. And and that's justified. That makes sense. But if a man cheats, it's ironic that it's still her fault because she didn't give him enough sex. She didn't. She wasn't, you know, doing her job.

00:35:31:07 - 00:35:53:00
Lisa Sonni
There's no accountability when men have a very easy opportunity to exit these relationships. If they're so unhappy, but instead they want to stay in the relationship. I see a real benefit. And I mean, I don't want to even frame that. Like, that's my opinion. It's obviously been studied that men benefit from these relationships, but given that they're not taking accountability.

00:35:53:00 - 00:36:04:14
Lisa Sonni
And of course I'm talking about toxic and abusive men, they're not taking accountability in these relationships, but they stay in the relationships. How does it harm the relationship and the woman in the relationship, do you.

00:36:04:14 - 00:36:24:00
Lex_Therapy
Think, I mean, all the ways that you just listed to be like, do I feel like you answered the question as well? I think it does. It does harm in all those ways. And I think like no one looks at the knock on effects in future relationships those people might have if they break out of that. So what they're not doing is they're not healing from the mistakes and the behaviors that they, you know, contributed to, however horrific they may be.

00:36:24:03 - 00:36:41:00
Lex_Therapy
When I did couples work for for a brief time, one of the things that I always noticed was when you have a man and woman in front of you and you were like saying, like, I'm going to see, I'm going to see you one on one to get an understanding. It would always be him saying things like, well, I don't mean always, but as a, as a common trend, let's say, well, you know, we're not having sex.

00:36:41:00 - 00:36:57:23
Lex_Therapy
Is something seriously wrong? We haven't been having sex for a while. It's been a long time. She doesn't really want to be anywhere near me, physically or intimately. So something's up when I go and talk to her. It's like for months on end, I've been explaining things that have been upsetting me. I've been talking about the things that, you know he does that makes things more difficult.

00:36:58:04 - 00:37:18:02
Lex_Therapy
He's not listening, he's not changing. And it's really interesting how for me, at times it seems that men feels like they feel like there's a problem with sex stops and women feel like there's a problem where they're not listened to. And like, I always believe the communication is the foundation to a successful relationship. Once you start losing that communication, everything else starts to crumble on top of it.

00:37:18:06 - 00:37:42:12
Lex_Therapy
Right? So what women were sort of saying at times was, I feel like I'm with a child constantly clearing up after them, constantly telling them that they need to do this and blah, blah, blah. Now, if you wanted to also look up, I suppose slight psychosexual analytics of that. If you're looking in like, you know, to, for example, you'd sort of think, well, if you're in parent mode and you're viewing him as in child mode, the last thing you want to do is have sex or intimacy with someone during as a child or your child.

00:37:42:15 - 00:38:00:13
Lex_Therapy
So is there any wonder why the intimacy is not there? And it's understandable from how it's got to this point? So one of them is talking about the journey, and the other one is talking about the here and now. We're not having sex now. Something's wrong. I've been trying to say there's a problem for ages, so of course now I'm not leaning to wanting to be intimate with you because I'm not feeling appreciated.

00:38:00:13 - 00:38:14:08
Lex_Therapy
I'm not feeling heard, understood, listened to. And so I don't know whether that is always necessarily associated to abusive tendencies, but in terms of breakdowns and dynamics in those communications and how it leads to problems, I used to get that quite a lot.

00:38:14:09 - 00:38:32:21
Lisa Sonni
Now I label that as abuse because what I hear is some level of coercion, you know, and like, we're not doing this enough and there's an entitlement to like, you owe this to me and there's no accountability on what got us here. And I, I hate the topic of sexual coercion. I cannot tell you how much I hate it.

00:38:32:23 - 00:38:55:06
Lisa Sonni
I talk about it every so often because it's necessary. And you always see, like, well, if your libidos don't match and I'm like, stop, it's not. Libidos don't match. It's what drove two people who were, let's say, happy at one point with the frequency and quality and quantity to what's happened now. And it's always, she's broken. Something's wrong with her.

00:38:55:06 - 00:39:16:06
Lisa Sonni
She's rigid. Other women want to. Why don't you? And it's like, actually hundreds of thousands, if not millions of women are having sex. They don't want to have. And participating in this when they're not interested. And trying to explain why his behavior led her here. But I have also explained this to men who go see no accountability. It's all on him, right?

00:39:16:06 - 00:39:33:09
Lisa Sonni
She's not going to take any accountability. And it's like she you want her to take the accountability for how you treat her, because he could choose to treat her better. He could choose to end it. If he's not feeling like he's being treated well, he could be reading relationship books. He could be staying up at 2 a.m. watching YouTube videos.

00:39:33:09 - 00:39:52:03
Lisa Sonni
And but I always find that, like the women are responsible for the health of the relationship and men are just like, make it better and give me sex and give me my hot meal at the end of the day. And it's a very abusive mindset. Lack of accountability leads to abuse. I think in my my view is entitlement is the core.

00:39:52:07 - 00:40:14:19
Lisa Sonni
People talk about narcissism and borderline and any other disorders or mental health issue trauma. It's entitlement. Like to me, the center of it all is this I don't have to take accountability. I don't have to be different. I'm entitled to treat you this way. It's justified. It's really prevalent. I think a lot of the views that we're talking about next to how abusive relationships happen.

00:40:14:19 - 00:40:26:13
Lisa Sonni
That's why I love the content that men like you make that are helping at least catch a few men. Do you ever see success like in yes, a man to Your Side 100%?

00:40:26:19 - 00:40:39:04
Lex_Therapy
I can easily think of 3 or 4 men. I know it doesn't sound like a lot, and I'll be doing it for a year and a half. But I mean 3 or 4 men who have literally, like, changed but stayed with the platform. So I've had men that continue to come up on the panel to sort of say, you know, share this story.

00:40:39:04 - 00:41:09:18
Lex_Therapy
Like, listen, I've been here before. I know exactly where you are. And what's great about it is the ages range from like, you know, late 40s to even like 1920, not as in the day by day 2019. 20 year old. Sorry. Like so knowing that I'm, you know, reaching different people. I don't think I'm expecting or even the community is expecting a man to completely be misogyny free just from hearing things, but having a change of, you know, stance and opinion on some of the things that were already grounded as a belief is, is literally like, well, you know, you drop of the ocean is like, I don't think they'll have these conversations with their

00:41:09:18 - 00:41:30:12
Lex_Therapy
friends. Hopefully they'll challenge some of these behaviors that they might see that they wouldn't have challenged prior to having these conversations. So I always recognize that you're never going to really realize the true impact that these lives might have. But when there are men who continue to now come back to the space and who are now in the comments responding to these other men with their misogynistic views, it's like, this is this is great to see, like it.

00:41:30:13 - 00:41:44:02
Lex_Therapy
And yeah, it does feel great. It really does because I understand the bigger cause and I understand that I'm one person crazy content online, so I can only reach so many people, but anyone I can reach is still better than none. So. So yes, we do see changes.

00:41:44:04 - 00:42:03:02
Lisa Sonni
I'm so glad to hear that because on my side of social media. But I think also you're dealing with men who, if they're watching, they have to be either interested in trolling you or changing, I suppose, where on my side it's very much I deal with women who are dealing with abusive men, and abusive men are generally not interested in change.

00:42:03:05 - 00:42:26:00
Lisa Sonni
They're very good at performing it though. Like I'm not encouraging the abusive men to be in your comment sections or in your lives because I don't want them to pick up on things performatively, you know, I want them to really change, and I don't see therapy as a place for abusive men to change. But I actually, interestingly, do see this type of community with men that many men are building.

00:42:26:00 - 00:42:48:02
Lisa Sonni
I know of several actually male creators who have like Patreon and memberships where men can come in and actually communicate, build information. It's dismantling these belief systems. I think that's going to create the biggest change. In the meantime, many women are in relationships that are toxic and abusive and lack accountability, and they're dealing with all the weight of the blame.

00:42:48:04 - 00:43:04:00
Lisa Sonni
But I think if you're in a relationship and I'd love to hear what you think on this, but for women that are in relationships with this sort of more extreme type of man who is truly abusive and just absolutely not interested in accountability, I know it's easy to say, just leave. And that's not in any way what I'm saying.

00:43:04:00 - 00:43:18:23
Lisa Sonni
And I'm sure you wouldn't either. But like learning how to see this as a true lack of accountability, true entitlement, and figuring out a way to safely exit these relationships instead of being his rehab facility, you know?

00:43:19:00 - 00:43:39:10
Lex_Therapy
Yeah. And I think that there's statistics, isn't it, this sort of show that the most dangerous time for women during a is, is the point of leaving. So I completely yeah. It's it's not something that I specialized in in regards to therapy in terms of, you know, or area that I worked in. But I'm fully aware of a lot of the, I suppose, behaviors and it's horrible to know those out there.

00:43:39:13 - 00:43:58:18
Lex_Therapy
It really is. Because, you know, we sometimes see the, you know, one of the ways that these men do behave is like isolation techniques and it eventually just kind of consumes their whole life to believe that actually, that whole life is and I think one of the biggest things I do have a lot of people asking is things like, how do you identify red flags early on in kind of, you know, dating and relationships?

00:43:58:18 - 00:44:12:01
Lex_Therapy
And unfortunately, I think what's really difficult about that is there are a lot of men out there that don't reveal how they're going to behave in X amount of months, you know, they don't. They will. There are, like you say, performative. There are men that will say the right things because they know that the right things to say.

00:44:12:03 - 00:44:20:14
Lex_Therapy
And then when they feel comfortable and they've got that sense of, I suppose, power dynamic or controlled, starting to feed into it, it's drip fed. Yes.

00:44:20:16 - 00:44:40:08
Lisa Sonni
I so agree. I think my advice to women would be to slow down so that you have opportunity to see, you know, any, any possible red flags. The more you move quickly, especially with physical intimacy. And I mean obviously I mean spicy time, but I also mean holding hands and kissing and just touching. And these things kind of build chemistry.

00:44:40:08 - 00:44:57:20
Lisa Sonni
If we can just slow down a bit, we will see more. But I actually think when I tell people what I think are the biggest red flags, some of them are obvious. I think like a guy who refers to himself as a nice guy like that. For the self-proclaimed nice guys, being nice is good, but being a self-proclaimed I'm a nice guy.

00:44:58:00 - 00:45:19:18
Lisa Sonni
Anybody who identifies as an alpha, I think those things are a little bit obvious now. Yeah, it's like for me, look for a lack of accountability, look for entitlement, look for misogyny in more covert ways. They're actually not that good at hiding those things. They're very good at presenting them like they're facts. And then you see the confidence and you're sort of, oh, well, smitten.

00:45:19:22 - 00:45:36:17
Lisa Sonni
I see through it now. I swear I'm glad that I'm in a happy, healthy relationship because I think if I was dating now, I don't think any man would get past the first date or two with me. In all honesty, it would be very hard for anyone because I'm like, Hawkeye's with some of this behavior now. Maybe hypervigilance is a trauma response, but.

00:45:36:20 - 00:46:06:22
Lex_Therapy
Well, that's why I say with regards to dating, I always say like I would encourage men to actually, you know, tap into their emotions a bit more because again, it starts early, it starts before relationships. It starts in friendships, it starts at home. And if like, you know, fathers, if I was up there can encourage their sons to actually if for them to, to have, you know, healthy conversations about things when I think about how I could be proud of my son in the future, I would love to know that one of his friends of school was feeling sad or upset, and he went over there to console them and be there for.

00:46:07:01 - 00:46:19:19
Lex_Therapy
I would love to have that kind of feedback about, you know, you know, if he came home and he was like, my friend was really sad. Today, I comfort him. I check that he was okay and, you know, he told me blah, blah, blah. I would be like, I know my work here is done, but I would be like, that is what I would strive for, right?

00:46:19:23 - 00:46:39:18
Lex_Therapy
Because that's going to just feed into not even necessarily any relationship dynamic, but friends work, sports by team building, all of those kind of things. It just raises emotional intelligence. And I think that that's one of the biggest things that men don't place value in. But it is also one of the biggest things women are looking for in a relationship at the moment.

00:46:39:18 - 00:46:56:01
Lex_Therapy
I think recently when I look online, it was emotional intelligence, communication and kindness, and these are things that men have never really said. That's what I'm going to strive to achieve as opposed to being a protector and provider. And, you know, we live in a very different world now. And so we're seeing lots of dynamics of things changing.

00:46:56:06 - 00:47:09:18
Lex_Therapy
But I'm not personally seeing men changing their priorities in regards to what they want to try and attain or achieve, not even for the sake of relationships or for themselves. Like emotional intelligence is just net positive for you on all areas of life.

00:47:09:18 - 00:47:30:13
Lisa Sonni
I mean, the amount of men. And again, I am aware and and I hope I never stop being aware of how much I spend on like this side of social media. So I do attract like the worst of the worst kind of men. And I remind myself often that there are good men, and I have a brother and a son and a and a partner and a father who are good men.

00:47:30:13 - 00:47:46:05
Lisa Sonni
So I know that it's out there, male friends and friends who've got husbands that are good. But on the internet, particularly Facebook, on the internet, you get a lot of men that are just like, well, that's why men are sick of dating women now. It's why we're choosing to be single. And I'm like, well, you're not choosing to be single.

00:47:46:05 - 00:48:07:09
Lisa Sonni
You're choosing to be in my comment section, whining, trying to get me to change. And lower my standards. Maybe not me specifically, but getting women to lower their standards and getting women to take accountability for men's behavior. So that will date you. I don't actually think men want to be alone. I think women are choosing it now as the alternative is to be with an emotionally unintelligent man.

00:48:07:14 - 00:48:23:17
Lisa Sonni
But I do think we're all wired for partnership. I hope that it gets better. I hope that we're both doing our part. I have to admit, I'm teaching women to leave men like this, and you're teaching the men to be better. So hopefully in 50 years this bridges something and we get to a better place as a collective.

00:48:23:17 - 00:48:42:12
Lisa Sonni
But it's been an amazing conversation with you about accountability and defensiveness and entitlement and all that. So I really appreciate it. I want to tell everybody to follow you on social media. I know TikTok is kind of your biggest one, so let's therapy. Please check that out everybody, and you'll you'll see some really amazing content. But thank you so much.

00:48:42:12 - 00:48:56:08
Lex_Therapy
Not stay. Thank you so much as well. It's like underscore therapy. But yes that is that is my tag. And I mean I want Instagram but I mean it's more like if I do a video on tik of shove it on Instagram, but yes, TikTok and I do lives like 4 or 5 times a week. So yeah, thank you so much as well.

00:48:56:08 - 00:48:59:00
Lex_Therapy
It's been an amazing conversation and I've loved it. So thank you for me.

00:48:59:00 - 00:49:09:11
Lisa Sonni
On if this episode gave you clarity share it with someone who needs it. Thanks for being here and for being honest with yourself. And remember, you're stronger than before.

00:49:09:12 - 00:49:13:17
Music
Stronger than before.